as a person with limited means, I welcome GO to Sebastopol. you say no chain stores, and yet we have Safeway, Round Table and others. Many of us who live here have a hard time with the prices, which are high. If I can save some money and have a healthier diet because I can afford better choices, I am all for it. People must be reminded that not everyone in our town has sufficient funds for the high prices. and while I love Fircrest, I rarely shop there. I am a shut in and have to have my groceries delivered, and they do not offer that service. GO will be a blessing for folks like me who need to eat well while being able to afford it. while I love the small town feel of our town, we must realize that times are hard and our town needs to serve all of us, not some of us. there is enough of that going around as it is. Thanks.
I wish we could get down to the real argument sooner than later. There are plenty of statements of what people are against, but the real divide is what they are fighting for. What is our ideal of how Sebastopol looks and operates? Is Sebastopol a quaint artisan town that primarily serves the needs and interests of its immediate affluent neighbors, or is it the gateway to West County, servicing the interests and needs of a larger, more diverse population? Is Sebastopol to be a 12/116 drive thru city, or is it to be a destination stop for locals and outsiders? Which of these visions or blend of visions produces a sustainable visitor, recycled revenue, and tax base to achieve the intimate, healthy community we all desire?
For instance, the highlighted flyer has a surface argument to protect the independent grocery stores in Sebastopol: Fircrest Market, Pacific Market, Community Market, and Andy’s. On the face of it, it sounds like an economic cannibalization of our local treasures by a nasty chain store. But, this can't possibly be the foundation of the argument against GO. We have several thriving independent stores, precisely because locals choose them over the existing chain stores, despite pricing and due to a focus on local goods. GO will likely attract more shoppers to the city, meaning more customer opportunities for everyone. If there is significant cannibalization, it won't be our independents, it will likely be of the other chain stores that don't have a local profit sharing structure: Lucky, Safeway, and Whole Foods. Are we OK with those stores having competition?
If the primary argument is about economics, then why is nobody addressing the elephant in the room - property ownership? Do we have a local ordinance which prohibits outside/corporate ownership of the downtown properties? I'd be interested to know how much of rent and lease payments stay within Sebastopol, West County, or even Sonoma County at large. Is anyone suggesting that we don't allow outside developers and landlords to purchase our local properties? Of course not, because we don't have the local liquidity or interest to facilitate a healthy local property market. Local property owners win when outside interests bring outside money to maintain or raise other local property values.
It's OK to reveal that this is a discussion about town character. Yes, it reveals some uncomfortable truths. But, the sooner we speak to this reality, the sooner we get to finding an economically viable way to make it happen. Who are we trying to be?
As fond a I am of Grocery Outlet, I am in the camp with our existing grocery stores. Even if it would take an effort of requesting Sebastopol residents contribute funds, the old Rite Aide location needs to become a Community Center. The city needs to purchase it and make it the central hub for community services. Hands down, it must become our city's nerve center. When I tell people that the city needs to buy that location, I am told that the city can't afford it. My reply, "The city CAN'T afford not to buy it. We need that property for our community."
Not a fan at all of putting our local groceries out of business. I'm willing to pay a little more to buy local. We already have 6-7 grocery stores in this tiny town. We do not need another one and certainly not another chain store. Let's put Lucky's and Safeway out of business and maybe then we should consider GO. Joking aside, there are thousands of terrible examples of towns all over the country losing their identity and their soul as chain stores move in. Show that we love this town for its individuality and tell GO we have enough grocery stores.
I'm with the local grocers. We have really good local businesses here and do not need one more. I'm strongly opposed putting another grocer in Sebastopol. Not only don't we need it, I support the locally owned businesses we have.
I sympathize with Paula, but Sebastopol has enough grocery stores, and enough traffic. The existing stores can accommodate Paula’s needs, and others who need delivery services and discounted pricing for elderly and disabled people. There are other options for such people other than allowing a monstrous new grocery store to open.
The quality of life for everyone, and the availability of existing jobs in Sebastopol, should not be held hostage to such circumstances. I love Fircrest, a family owned business for generations. Andy’s also.
The chain stores, Safeway and Lucky’s, definitely are more corporate driven, and do not have as good of prices they could and should provide, given the huge economy of scale they have. But Lucky’s, formerly a local store, has a great deli, and has provided jobs for locals for generations. Though corporate, Safeway has also been present for many years and employ many locals. Allowing a new, large corporate grocery store to open a block away is preposterous. Their pay rate is likely low compared to the others. Their opening would likely result in one of the existing stores going out of business.
Then there is the issue of parking and traffic. Are they kidding, placing a large store where the parking lot is so limited. And the traffic, already like a parking lot during rush hours!
Oh, most importantly, I hate their marketing jingle, ha ha!
Unsurprisingly, given my comments above, I vote NO on allowing Grocery Outlet. But, like the issue with CVS moving to its current location, it will be who has the most money for lawyers who will win.
Do people really think they are saving money driving out of town for groceries? Show us the calculations. Some people will spend $10 on gas plus $3 on wear and tear to save $5 on groceries. While driving their $80,000 SUV and talking on their $1000 iPhone.
I just learned that all grocery outlet stores will be identical from now on. That means that even if the manaager or owner of GO wanted to do something original and distinctive in Sebastopol, it would not be possible. One more strike against the store
as a person with limited means, I welcome GO to Sebastopol. you say no chain stores, and yet we have Safeway, Round Table and others. Many of us who live here have a hard time with the prices, which are high. If I can save some money and have a healthier diet because I can afford better choices, I am all for it. People must be reminded that not everyone in our town has sufficient funds for the high prices. and while I love Fircrest, I rarely shop there. I am a shut in and have to have my groceries delivered, and they do not offer that service. GO will be a blessing for folks like me who need to eat well while being able to afford it. while I love the small town feel of our town, we must realize that times are hard and our town needs to serve all of us, not some of us. there is enough of that going around as it is. Thanks.
I wish we could get down to the real argument sooner than later. There are plenty of statements of what people are against, but the real divide is what they are fighting for. What is our ideal of how Sebastopol looks and operates? Is Sebastopol a quaint artisan town that primarily serves the needs and interests of its immediate affluent neighbors, or is it the gateway to West County, servicing the interests and needs of a larger, more diverse population? Is Sebastopol to be a 12/116 drive thru city, or is it to be a destination stop for locals and outsiders? Which of these visions or blend of visions produces a sustainable visitor, recycled revenue, and tax base to achieve the intimate, healthy community we all desire?
For instance, the highlighted flyer has a surface argument to protect the independent grocery stores in Sebastopol: Fircrest Market, Pacific Market, Community Market, and Andy’s. On the face of it, it sounds like an economic cannibalization of our local treasures by a nasty chain store. But, this can't possibly be the foundation of the argument against GO. We have several thriving independent stores, precisely because locals choose them over the existing chain stores, despite pricing and due to a focus on local goods. GO will likely attract more shoppers to the city, meaning more customer opportunities for everyone. If there is significant cannibalization, it won't be our independents, it will likely be of the other chain stores that don't have a local profit sharing structure: Lucky, Safeway, and Whole Foods. Are we OK with those stores having competition?
If the primary argument is about economics, then why is nobody addressing the elephant in the room - property ownership? Do we have a local ordinance which prohibits outside/corporate ownership of the downtown properties? I'd be interested to know how much of rent and lease payments stay within Sebastopol, West County, or even Sonoma County at large. Is anyone suggesting that we don't allow outside developers and landlords to purchase our local properties? Of course not, because we don't have the local liquidity or interest to facilitate a healthy local property market. Local property owners win when outside interests bring outside money to maintain or raise other local property values.
It's OK to reveal that this is a discussion about town character. Yes, it reveals some uncomfortable truths. But, the sooner we speak to this reality, the sooner we get to finding an economically viable way to make it happen. Who are we trying to be?
As fond a I am of Grocery Outlet, I am in the camp with our existing grocery stores. Even if it would take an effort of requesting Sebastopol residents contribute funds, the old Rite Aide location needs to become a Community Center. The city needs to purchase it and make it the central hub for community services. Hands down, it must become our city's nerve center. When I tell people that the city needs to buy that location, I am told that the city can't afford it. My reply, "The city CAN'T afford not to buy it. We need that property for our community."
Not a fan at all of putting our local groceries out of business. I'm willing to pay a little more to buy local. We already have 6-7 grocery stores in this tiny town. We do not need another one and certainly not another chain store. Let's put Lucky's and Safeway out of business and maybe then we should consider GO. Joking aside, there are thousands of terrible examples of towns all over the country losing their identity and their soul as chain stores move in. Show that we love this town for its individuality and tell GO we have enough grocery stores.
I'm with the local grocers. We have really good local businesses here and do not need one more. I'm strongly opposed putting another grocer in Sebastopol. Not only don't we need it, I support the locally owned businesses we have.
I sympathize with Paula, but Sebastopol has enough grocery stores, and enough traffic. The existing stores can accommodate Paula’s needs, and others who need delivery services and discounted pricing for elderly and disabled people. There are other options for such people other than allowing a monstrous new grocery store to open.
The quality of life for everyone, and the availability of existing jobs in Sebastopol, should not be held hostage to such circumstances. I love Fircrest, a family owned business for generations. Andy’s also.
The chain stores, Safeway and Lucky’s, definitely are more corporate driven, and do not have as good of prices they could and should provide, given the huge economy of scale they have. But Lucky’s, formerly a local store, has a great deli, and has provided jobs for locals for generations. Though corporate, Safeway has also been present for many years and employ many locals. Allowing a new, large corporate grocery store to open a block away is preposterous. Their pay rate is likely low compared to the others. Their opening would likely result in one of the existing stores going out of business.
Then there is the issue of parking and traffic. Are they kidding, placing a large store where the parking lot is so limited. And the traffic, already like a parking lot during rush hours!
Oh, most importantly, I hate their marketing jingle, ha ha!
Unsurprisingly, given my comments above, I vote NO on allowing Grocery Outlet. But, like the issue with CVS moving to its current location, it will be who has the most money for lawyers who will win.
One could argue that Pacific Market is a formula business given its new ownership. Look at its flyers plus its corporate ownership.
But its location is outside the downtown area designated by the ordinance.
I don’t believe that is true. See map here: https://www.sebastopoltimes.com/p/grocery-outlet-homes-in-on-sebastopol
Sure but does that suggest that two wrong make a right or maybe the reverse
Do people really think they are saving money driving out of town for groceries? Show us the calculations. Some people will spend $10 on gas plus $3 on wear and tear to save $5 on groceries. While driving their $80,000 SUV and talking on their $1000 iPhone.
Ha, one of the realities of “free will”….
“But I wanna do it…”
I just learned that all grocery outlet stores will be identical from now on. That means that even if the manaager or owner of GO wanted to do something original and distinctive in Sebastopol, it would not be possible. One more strike against the store